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> Roti inguste sau mai late?, ... cat de late? dar inalte? si cum trage?
comisaru
post Oct 5 2006, 06:57 PM
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Eu acum am 195/55/15 pe fata si 195/60/15 pe spate si-as vrea sa-mi pun pe spate 215/50 sau 55, dar nu stiu daca mai trag de ele cum trebuie cei 90 de cai ai mei.
Bine, as vrea mai late si pe fata, dar nu am servo si...
Cam cat de tare se simte la volan diferenta de latime de la 195 la 205?


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Sorin
post Oct 5 2006, 07:02 PM
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de simtit se simte la volan iar de tras o sa traga la fel
eu iti recomand 205/50/15
nu 215


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comisaru
post Oct 5 2006, 08:57 PM
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Eu nu-nteleg un lucru: mie mi s-ar parea normal ca latimea cauciucului sa nu influenteze felul in care trage masina. Adica daca inlocuiesc cauciucurile de pe spate 195/x/15 cu unele 215/y/15 (unde x si y sunt proportionale a.i. inaltimea rotii sa fie aceeasi) n-ar trebui sa se simta in felul in care trage masina (zic eu) si totusi lumea-mi spune:"pai pui cauciucuri late sa te rupa la consum..."


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florin83
post Oct 5 2006, 09:12 PM
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QUOTE (comisaru @ Oct 5 2006, 07:57 PM) *
Cam cat de tare se simte la volan diferenta de latime de la 195 la 205?


eu am trecut de la 205/50 la 195/50 si se misca mai usor volanul cu astea mai inguste, dar nu e mare diferenta..
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316i
post Oct 5 2006, 09:18 PM
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QUOTE (comisaru @ Oct 5 2006, 09:57 PM) *
Eu nu-nteleg un lucru: mie mi s-ar parea normal ca latimea cauciucului sa nu influenteze felul in care trage masina. Adica daca inlocuiesc cauciucurile de pe spate 195/x/15 cu unele 215/y/15 (unde x si y sunt proportionale a.i. inaltimea rotii sa fie aceeasi) n-ar trebui sa se simta in felul in care trage masina (zic eu) si totusi lumea-mi spune:"pai pui cauciucuri late sa te rupa la consum..."


Cine iti spune de consum e cazul sa mai invete. Asa mi-au spus si mie toti cand am trecut de la 195/60/R14 la 205/45/R16 "vaaaaaaaai, o sa-ti consume cu 1l mai muuuuuuuult, vaaaaaaai". Aiurea, n-a consumat deloc mai mult, cel putin nu in asa fel incat sa reiasa din calcule. Deci nu te priponi in ideea cu consumul. Myth busted.


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Viper05
post Oct 5 2006, 10:05 PM
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QUOTE (comisaru @ Oct 5 2006, 09:57 PM) *
Eu nu-nteleg un lucru: mie mi s-ar parea normal ca latimea cauciucului sa nu influenteze felul in care trage masina. Adica daca inlocuiesc cauciucurile de pe spate 195/x/15 cu unele 215/y/15 (unde x si y sunt proportionale a.i. inaltimea rotii sa fie aceeasi) n-ar trebui sa se simta in felul in care trage masina (zic eu) si totusi lumea-mi spune:"pai pui cauciucuri late sa te rupa la consum..."


Intotdeauna cauciucurile mai late se vor simti in felul cum trage masina


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Sorin
post Oct 6 2006, 06:21 AM
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de simtit se simte dar este un fin
directia o sa -ti mearga mai greu deoarece pata de contact cu asfaltul este mai mare =>frecare mai mare
iar la consum daca ai cumva 50 de cai pe masina o sa-l simti
eu asa il simt
cand am trecut de la 175/70r13 la 195/60r14 am simtit ca directia este mai greaoie
dar cand am pus 195/50/15 am simtit ca trag de masina


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316i
post Oct 6 2006, 10:58 AM
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Sorin>Pardon, eu am zis mine. Nu am luat in calcul si varianta asta. Scuze. cha (40).gif


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Sorin
post Oct 6 2006, 11:03 AM
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QUOTE (316i @ Oct 6 2006, 11:58 AM) *
Sorin>Pardon, eu am zis mine. Nu am luat in calcul si varianta asta. Scuze. cha (40).gif



n-ai de ce evil (1).gif


Las' ca o sa cresc eu mae

This post has been edited by Sorin: Oct 6 2006, 11:03 AM


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Darren
post Oct 6 2006, 04:01 PM
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QUOTE (316i @ Oct 5 2006, 10:18 PM) *
Cine iti spune de consum e cazul sa mai invete. Asa mi-au spus si mie toti cand am trecut de la 195/60/R14 la 205/45/R16 "vaaaaaaaai, o sa-ti consume cu 1l mai muuuuuuuult, vaaaaaaai". Aiurea, n-a consumat deloc mai mult, cel putin nu in asa fel incat sa reiasa din calcule. Deci nu te priponi in ideea cu consumul. Myth busted.


Forta de frecare creste o data cu suprafata de contact. La cauciucuri mai late suprafata de contact (cu asflatul) este mai mare, deci forta de frecare e mai mare decat la cauciucuri mai inguste.
Forta de frecare (a rotilor cu asfaltul) este una din cele care opun rezistenta inaintarii masinii. Daca maresti aceasta forta, pentru a avea acelasi demaraj vei apasa pedala de acceleratie un pic mai mult atunci cand pui cauciucuri mai late.
Parerea mea tongue.gif

LE: mie mi-a crescut consumul de cand am pus 205 in loc de 195
si directia merge mai greu.

This post has been edited by Darren: Oct 6 2006, 04:03 PM


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316i
post Oct 6 2006, 04:35 PM
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Directia normal ca merge mai greu cand pui roti mai mari, atat ca diametru cat si ca latime.
Cand am trecut de la 14 la 16 n-am sesizat nici o diferenta de consum. Diametrul total al rotilor pe 16 e acelasi cu cel de la alea pe 14. Bine, -2mm.


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Darren
post Oct 6 2006, 05:48 PM
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Subiectul principal al postului meu era despre legatura dintre cresterea latimii cauciucurilor si cresterea consumului.

Later edit: de fapt suntem offtopic cu consumul, aici e vb de 325ix


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florin83
post Oct 18 2006, 09:18 PM
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cati litrii de lichid atf trebuie pt servodirectie?
cred ca intra mai mult decat la un e30 normal ca mai are niste tevi de racire..
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316i
post Oct 18 2006, 10:11 PM
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Sub un litru.


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ve
post Nov 8 2006, 01:53 PM
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QUOTE (Darren @ Oct 6 2006, 04:01 PM) *
Forta de frecare (a rotilor cu asfaltul) este una din cele care opun rezistenta inaintarii masinii.


Total gresit. Forta de frecare a rotilor cu asfaltul este forta care deplaseaza masina.


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iulian325
post Nov 8 2006, 02:07 PM
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fizic exprimarea e aiurea
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TiL
post Nov 8 2006, 03:37 PM
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QUOTE (Darren @ Oct 6 2006, 04:01 PM) *
Forta de frecare creste o data cu suprafata de contact.



QUOTE (ve @ Nov 8 2006, 01:53 PM) *
Total gresit. Forta de frecare a rotilor cu asfaltul este forta care deplaseaza masina.


Amandoi aveti dreptate in, afara de acel "Total gresit" biggrin.gif

Ideea e ca Darren se refera la frecarea la rostogolire iar ve la frecarea prin alunecare intre suprafetele de contact cauciuc/asfalt. Cea din urma intr-adevar genereaza miscarea fie ea rectilinie/circulara, accelerata cu acceleratie pozitiva/negativa. Dar asta nu face obiectul consumului. Consumul e dat in oarecare masura de frecarea la rostogolire.
Din experienta, nu stiu cum e mai bine, cu cauciuc mai lat/mai ingust. Dar cred ca un cauciuc mai lat combinat si cu talon mic (janta mare) ar trebui sa asigure forte mai mici de frecare la rostogolire, adica o rostogolire mai usoara. Asta pentru ca pata de contact la un cauciuc lat e mai aproape de ideal (ideal e o linie dreapta cu grosime zero):
- cauciuc ingust:

..______
./...........\
|.............|
|.............|
\_______/

-cauciuc lat:

..____________
./.....................\
|.......................|
\_____________/



Nu stiu daca treaba sta chiar asa, dar e o ipoteza...


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florin83
post Nov 8 2006, 04:57 PM
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asta e valabil doar la 325ix? huh.gif ca parca asa se cheama topicu.. sleep.gif
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ve
post Nov 8 2006, 05:40 PM
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"forta de frecare la rostogolire" se numeste de fapt "rezistenta la rostogolire" si NU este o forta de frecare. asha ca lasa tu totalul gresit la locul lui. oricum eu m-am referit numai la ce am pus in quote ca e total gresit nu la tot ce a zis in post.

...si da: suntem off topic


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comisaru
post Nov 9 2006, 12:15 AM
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Treaba e ca "fizic exprimarea e aiurea". Forta de frecare a rotilor cu asfaltul este cea care face posibila deplasarea (o consecinta a atractiei gravitationale), nu cea care "deplaseaza masina", si ca orice forta de frecare, "opune rezistenta inaintarii masinii".


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