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> Si a mea...., E46 320i
BBo
post Oct 26 2020, 09:29 PM
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Am uitat sa menționez faptulca valoarea de - 8,59% apare īn absolut toate topicurile de pe internet legate de problema asta. Deci sigur e ceva specific M54 căruia īncă nimeni nu a reușit să-i dea de cap. E prea dubios sa nu fie asa....
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bartro
post Oct 27 2020, 11:23 AM
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Sunt curios ce sa intample daca muti vacuum de la regulator de presiune undeva dupa clapeta de acceleratie. Poate duce spre mai spre 0. Din ce citeam componentele ar fi inca acolo si functionale, doar nu mai e conectat ca la motoare mai vechi.


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BBo
post Oct 27 2020, 01:34 PM
Post #283


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Zici sa-l mut din F-ul de pe cotul de admisie undeva la portul din spatele admisiei, unde se facea 02pilot mod.
In modul asta, se inverseaza practic comenzile catre filtru/FPR - vacuum la ralanti si presiune ~atmosferica in accelerare.

Hai ca ajung saptamana viitoare la masina si vedem ce zice si pacientul.
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bartro
post Oct 27 2020, 02:32 PM
Post #284


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Da, de curiozitate.
Nu s-ar chiar inversa, ca unde e F nu prea e depresiune de laut in calcul niciodata.


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BBo
post Nov 3 2020, 06:47 PM
Post #285


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  • verificat toate contactele de la debitmetru la ECU
  • curatat debitmetru
  • inlocuit bujii

Nicio schimbare, LT-urile au urcat pe la -10,2% (cat atat erau si inainte dupa un drum mai lung), dar am observat o schimbare in ST-uri: in accelerare in loc sa treaca pe + - cum se intampla anterior (injectoarele deschid mai mult), acum scad masiv intre -7 si -10/-11%. Asta inseamna o reducere totala in jurul a -18%/-20% in accelerare huh.gif . In decelerare ST-uri raman la 0%, actionand doar LT-urile de -10,2%.

Am facut un test la ralanti scotand mufa de la debitmetru in mers, ECU a trecut pe harta ideala in care ambele trims erau ~0%.
Nu cred ca e debitmetrul, valorile inregistrate se incadreaza in normele regasite pe net, undeva la 3,4-3,6g/s la ralanti si cresc in functie de accelerare.

Situatia a devenit cam albastra cand am scos bujiile vechi: dry.gif


Nu stiu daca se vede foarte bine, dar toate erau ude bine pe filet. Si nu e benzina dry.gif .
Era ud si in interiorul cilindrului, mai putin la 1 si 4.

Daca tot eram acolo, am facut si un test de compresie. Ma rog, am incercat pentru ca chinezaria de ceas avea furtunul indoit si nu l-am putut infileta decat la cilindrul 1 si 5.
N-am respectat intocmai pasii cu scos releu ECU, pedala pana la capat, cel putin 6 rotatii... ca n-am stiut in prima faza.


N-am reusit sa mut vacuumul de la filtru in spatele admisiei pentru ca vine pe teava metalica pana in apropierea F-ului, nu o pot forta/indoi si n-am avut destul furtun de 3,5mm ca sa-l duc pana in spate.
Cu toate astea, masina merge bine, are zvac, a pornit mai usor dupa schimbul de bujii si pare sa mearga o idee mai rotund la ralanti.

Trebuie sa fac rost de un manometru cu valva Schraeder pentru a masura presiunea in rampa. Totodata, imi e teama ca faza cu fuel trims sa nu fie un false-positive, pe internet mai zice unul altul ca BMW raporteaza fix pe dos, unde trims-uri negative ar insemna de fapt amestec sarac.


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BBo
post Nov 4 2020, 04:13 PM
Post #286


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QUOTE
In early I6s, it's connected to the crankcase side of the CCV so the FPR sees a slight vacuum of ~0.2 psi, which is a minuscule difference compared to atmospheric or the ~50 psi fuel pressure. In later engines it's connected to the air inlet boot between the MAF and throttle body which is at atmospheric pressure; no vacuum except for the tiny pressure drop across the engine air filter. So at least in the I6s, the FPR sees atmospheric pressure, not manifold vacuum.

Although not stated in any BMW tech docs I've seen, it seems to me that the purpose of this line is to ensure that the FPR sees only clean, filtered air at ambient pressure in order to eliminate the chance of the FPR becoming clogged or corroded by road dirt and crud. It isn't to manipulate fuel pressure at the injectors via manifold vacuum varying through the engine's operating range.




QUOTE
The FPR's on the majority of these cars are NOT vacuum controlled. There is a hose connected to these FPR's and EVERYONE refers to it as a "vacuum hose" which it IS NOT. The hose is actually an atmospheric vent line that is connected just behind the air filter so there is NO vacuum present at the FPR. If manifold vacuum is connected to the FPR, then the fuel pressure would drop approximately 10 PSI at idle and the car would run too Lean. DO NOT connect manifold vacuum to the fuel filter mounted FPR. Replacing a broken or missing hose on the fuel filter mounted FPR will make NO change in the engine performance or Fuel Trim values.

Assuming the car is stock and unmolested, and if the engine is actually reporting a "real" Rich condition, by the means of a NEGATIVE Long Term Fuel Trim, chances are there is one or more faulty, counterfeit or improperly connected sensor. There are PLENTY of counterfeit MAF sensors on the market, anyone can cast plastic and print labels these days. Lazy and/or ancient Pre-cat O2 sensors and/or O2 sensors connected improperly can also cause a true Rich condition. Evap vent solenoid problems with leaks or having the wrong wiring connected to them is about the only other item that could cause an official Rich condition.

The ICV should have virtually NO impact on Fuel Trim values, so this can be ruled out.

Resetting the Adaptations will not "correct" or "solve" a Rich or Lean condition. The DME is always Adapting and once you replace the offending sensor, correct the wiring or solve the real reason the engine thinks it is running Rich, the Adaptations should adjust normally over the next tank of fuel.

It is really not that hard to solve these issues if you read the proper information and listen to the correct forum Members. This all being stated, I have found that there are many non North American vehicles with I believe the EU2 DME Tune that often run slightly Negative Fuel Trims once the vehicle is operating properly. This may be due to a number of reason, I have no specifics, but I am guessing that often non Ethanol fuels are are often found outside of North America and a few other reasons.


O sa mai iau la mana o data senzorii la care pot ajunge si verific cablajul sondelor lambda.

Ma gandesc sa nu fie ceva legat si de continutul de etanol din benzina actuala... ?

QUOTE
A traditional port injection spark-ignited engine was found to be not significantly influenced by the content of ethanol in gasoline. The engine was fuelled with blends until 85% by volume of ethanol. The standard ECU was able to control air/fuel composition retaining the target stoichiometric value with regular operation. Instead, spark advance set by the original ECU is affected by the ethanol content at parity of engine load, probably due to the injection time increasing that affects the logic controller. In the experimental activity, SA has been modified using a calibration tool software to compare the engine behaviour with all the tested blends at parity of in-cylinder cycle development.

A positive trend between the ethanol content and efficiency of the engine was found. In the paper, the efficiency improvement was analyzed with the available experimental data and considering a range of variability of gasoline lower heating value of
 MJ/kg. A minimum benefit of % of engine efficiency improving was obtained. Therefore, a reduction of tank-to-wheel CO2 emission can be achieved using gasoline/ethanol blends if the engine control unit is able to set the correct spark advance. The same spark advance of the gasoline case could be used to achieve the found efficiency improvement and to reduce emissions upstream the three-way catalyst.



Mai citisem si faptul ca s-ar datora bobinelor care se "consuma" in timp.... unsure.gif
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bartro
post Nov 5 2020, 03:42 PM
Post #287


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WWW e plin de pareri..
Cert e ca la motoare vechi fpr era legat de (de)presiune in admisie ca sa ai presiune constanta intre benzina inainte si aer sub injector, pentru ca influenteaza debitul. La motoare turbo si mai mult.
Dar, M30 cu motronic 1.3 avea un procesor pe 8 biti, cu ceas pana in 20MHz. Posibilitatiile la M54 erau alte, din punctul de vedere putere de calcul si memorie. Este posibil ca avansul tehnologic a facut irelevant variatia de cantitate de benzina injectata pe timp constant de deschidere din cauza variatii in presiune relativa intre rampa si admisie. Poate are harti pentru maf, turatie, pozitia clapeta de admisie din care deduce cat ar fi presiune in admisie. Ca parca map nu are M54.

Eu la M54 am masurat presiune de benzina scurt cu o manometru pentru presiune aer in cauciuc..


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BBo
post Nov 5 2020, 07:36 PM
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Eh, mi-am comandat un manometru dedicat, vreo 90 lei, sa fie acolo la garaj si pe viitor.

Intre timp, am descoperit ca DISA e moarta, membrana e ciupita si nu tine vacuum.


Nu stiu daca asta ar putea cauza amestecul bogat, ea fiind deschisa tot timpul, intra mai mult aer in toti cilindrii, teoretic amestecul ar fi mai sarac - exact invers.
Acum pentru prostia asta de membrana - codul inscris pe ea fiind 1928300562 - parca vad ca trebuie sa iau piesa cu totul. Nu pare sa o produca nimeni, apare in diverse kituri de reparatie sau individual dar pe site-uri poloneze sau rusesti.
Banuiam ca ceva se intampla pentru ca nu mai aveam zvacul ala de putere dupa 4K RPM... dar la o masina condusa rar mai uiti unele feeling-uri.

Maine o sa masor presiunea in rampa si apoi vad cum continui, la mijlocul lunii am ITP-ul si tre' sa ma organizez un pic.
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BBo
post Nov 6 2020, 07:11 PM
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Presiunea e in parametri (3,5bar +/-2), verificat cu doua ceasuri.



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bartro
post Nov 9 2020, 12:13 PM
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Deci smoke test nu arate totul.


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BBo
post Nov 9 2020, 05:44 PM
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Cred ca era imposibil sa fie detectata membrana la smoke test, trebuia sa treaca prin camera vacuumatica si apoi prin electrovalva ca sa ajunga la membrana asta...
Curios e ca am mai luat o valva din dezmembrari, la prima vedere tinea vacuum, dar cand m-am apucat sa o curat, am desfacut-o de curiozitate si avea 2 gauri laugh.gif . Depinde mult de zona in care dezvolta fisurile, daca e chiar pe sant - sunt 101% sanse sa nu mai tina vacuum, daca e mai pe laterale - scapi mai ieftin.

Pana la urma am comandat 2 membrane de la polonezi - 175 lei cu tot cu curier (vs 1200 lei valva noua OE). Am pus valva din dezmembrari pe masina pana dupa ITP si dupa aia o reconstruiesc pe a mea, fiind mai trainica (clapeta si pin metalic).
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BBo
post Nov 16 2020, 09:04 PM
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DISA din dezmembrari care la prima vedere pare in regula. Cica am pus-o doar ca sa pot merge la ITP cu masina... rolleyes.gif
Daca stiam o asamblam pe a mea la loc.



Polonezului i-a trebuit o saptamana sa-mi puna membranele la curier, nici acum n-au ajuns dry.gif
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BBo
post Nov 17 2020, 03:12 PM
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Hai ca m-a auzit polonezu' si a speriat curieru' biggrin.gif
E mai groasa ca cea originala - nu stiu daca e de bine sau nu, momentan. Rezistenta sigur pare, nu stiu cum se impaca grosimea cu flexibilitatea.

Functioneaza perfect in mana, am regresat si remontat inclusiv kitul cu clapeta si pin metalic daca tot eram aici.



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bartro
post Nov 18 2020, 07:11 PM
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M-ai facut curios cu disa, eu am facut test cu deget si il am considerat sanatos.
Unde e ciupit la tine parca seamana cu surubelnita infipta din greseala.


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post Nov 18 2020, 08:27 PM
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Ahaha, asa am crezut si eu prima data, dar 1) n-am introdus surubelnita atat de adanc, de fapt am lucrat foarte putin pe lateralul capacului, ci am desfacut-o din canalul de vacuum care merge la electrovalva si 2) pozitia normala a membranei este cea "relaxata" in care pivotul e impins de arc, iar membrana este in totalitate in partea inferioara a cupolei aleia.

Uite o poza cu pozitia in care o desfaci, practic e imposibil sa ajunga surubelnita acolo:


Faza e ca si la DISA luata din dezmembrari m-am pacalit, tinea vacuum pana am desfacut-o si am cascat ochii foarte bine ca sa nu o ciupesc. Si aia era rupta mai ciudat, tot pe cantul ala care flexeaza de fiecare data - ceea ce ma face sa cred ca ala e punctul slab, cedeaza de la atatea flexari si fiind pe cant, n-are cum sa se rupa decat cam asa, pe lung. In acelasi timp, te si pacaleste fiind rupt aacolo, pentru ca e presata intre capac si pivot capac si daca prinde o pozitie in care tine vacuum, te minte.

Chiar daca as fi ciupit-o, consider ca-s 170 lei bine investiti, cu rezerva pentru inca alti 2x 300.000 km biggrin.gif

* de fapt, stai ca n-am mentionat, dar am verificat posturile de mai sus si nu am scris efectiv: eu testasem DISA inainte de a o desface si nu tinea nimic, era moarta clapeta. D-aia ma apucasem de desfacut smile.gif))). Am eu unele fixuri, dar nu ma apucam de desfacut piese functionale biggrin.gif

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bartro
post Nov 19 2020, 12:01 PM
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Da, am vazut ca e imposibil sa fie ciupit la demontaj, dar fix ca astfel de dauna arata smile.gif
La mine tie vacuum bine, permanent.


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post Nov 27 2020, 05:59 PM
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S-a stricat jucaria dry.gif .
Am pus DISA mea la loc si nu s-a schimbat nimic, drept pentru care am descoperit ca mi-au "murit" sondele lambda pre-cat.
Ambele, ceea ce e foaaaaarteeeee dubios.

Am o banuiala si ar trebui sa verific iar cablaje, mufe si sunt prea sictirit sa lucrez pe frigul asta.

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bartro
post Yesterday, 09:12 AM
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Și eu le am īnlocuit pe cele pre-cat după ce am văzut că voltajul scade la 0 după pornire. Totuși apoi am descoperit că mașină de fapt trăgea air fals, posibil sa nu fie fost sondele stricate. Bine că nu sunt chiar așa scumpe.
Și care sunt șanse să se strice īn același moment?


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post Yesterday, 08:43 PM
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Hmmm, ar trebui sa fie ditamai gaura in motor sa-mi sara fuel trims-urile de la -10% la +27,34%... n-am facut alte modificari in afara inlocuirii DISA.
Ba da, mint - am pus un aditiv in benzina, pentru ITP, doar sa fiu sigur ca nu am probleme la noxe. Ce putea sa faca ?

Imi mai amintesc o eroare veche legata de P0151 low voltage, ceva de genul - tot pe sonde.
Dar da, e ciudat sa moara amandoua dupa ce in urma cu cateva saptamani pareau sa functioneze.

Tu pe unde trageai aer fals ? Si se inchid singure de tot in caz de amestec sarac, nu mai raspund la semnal/rezistenta, nici macar 0,01V ?

Si inca ceva: citersc ca de obicei voltajul lor ar trebui sa fie in plaja 0,2-0,8V, dar chiar si in printscreen-urile mai vechi, valorile erau mult sub 0,1V (0,07/0,09V)... Nu imi dau seama daca sondele reactioneaza la amestec sau amestecul la sonde (adica fuel trims-urile in afara limitei la 27,34% determina oprirea sondei sau sonda determina fuel trims spre max)...

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bartro
post Yesterday, 10:35 PM
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Sunt aditive care stric sonde, trebuie sa scrie pe ambalaj dacă merge. Eu aveam furtun īntre ccv si oil dipstick retezat. Apoi am incercat sa le masor crezānd că erau ca altele, dar aparent cele zirconia le strici foarte ușor.
Sondele nu se īnchid, ele doar măsoare cantitate de oxigen in gaze.
0.1v īnseamnă lambda > 1 adică sărac.

https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Albert...parameter-l.png

Poate diagnoză ta arata greșit cu un factor 10. Nu avea cum sa merge in closed loop daca erau stricate.


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